Having spent a wonderful year or so in Korea I have had occasion to speak of my experiences to people I meet here in Taiwan. I have been surprised to see some anti-Korean sentiment amongst people I have met here.
I first got a hint of this soon after I arrived in Taiwan. At a Sichuan style restaurant here with a group of friends I was asked what I ate in Korea and I said that I was a huge fan of Korean food, and that is probably what I miss most about it now having left Seoul. My words were met with what seemed to me utter shock and disbelief around the table. It was almost like I had insulted their mothers.
One of my friends responded, “But in Korea all they eat is meat and kimchi! What is there about Korean food to like? They have no vegetables!” I tried to explain that there are many dishes in Korea that have a wonderful assortment of vegetables but my further defense of Korean cuisine only seemed to make things worse. We moved on to other topics.
Since then I have kept my ears open when it comes to the way people I have met respond to things related to Korea and sometimes I have come right out and asked, “What do you think about Korea?” or “What is your impression about Korea.” The results have been interesting. Three recent responses:
1. Taipei, pro-Blue female. “Koreans are so arrogant! You know they tried to register the Dragon Boat race with [some UN organization] as a Korean tradition that they invented?”
2. Kaohsiung, female. “I hate (討厭）Korea! I have interacted with many Korean women at international conferences and they are always talking. They are so loud and very rude.”
3. Kaohsiung, male pro-Green graduate student. Has studied Korean at university level. “I hate (討厭) Koreans! I knew many Koreans at university and they were so rude, arrogant, and obsessed with their pride. Koreans hate the Japanese. They are always trying to show how they are as good as the Chinese, and when it comes to the Taiwanese, they look down (看不起) on us.
Though they fortunately lack any rocky islets to fight over and no effigies are being burnt in street protests, I was really surprised at the really strong emotions evoked here in Taiwan. I never got “我不太喜歡” or other more moderate phrases. The sentiment was unusually direct. Of course, it is nowhere near the kinds of reactions I have seen among many young Chinese towards the Japanese (first encountering these powerful emotions in Beijing in 1997 was my first motivation to study Sino-Japanese relations and the contentious historical issues in the region). Korean sentiments against the Japanese seems, by contrast, a little more tame these days, though I may get this impression because I have been hanging out with a lot of more younger “pro-Japanese” treasonous types when I lived in Seoul.
One explanation might be a general clash of personality types. As some of the comments above hint at, the generally more relaxed and polite personality style I have found to be common on this island may simply clash a bit more with the sometimes more intense and aggressive style often found on the peninsula to the north. Obviously, I have seen plenty of exceptions to this on both sides.
Something I heard indirectly which may play is role was from a Taiwanese woman who I’m told said that though Korea and Taiwan were long lauded as two of Asia’s leading economic “tigers” some Taiwanese feel like they “lost” to the larger and more powerful Korea, thus leading to the development of a kind of insecurity complex when they find themselves compared to their more populous and culturally distinct rival.
There is no doubt that Korea has a certain degree of international visibility that Taiwan lacks. Asus does not quite have the brand power of Samsung or LG and Taiwan’s cross-straits crisis doesn’t have the benefit of an official axis of evil member next door. If my Korean friends complain that most Americans can’t find their country on a map (to be fair, we apparently can’t seem to find most places on a map, even after we invade them) then imagine the chances of them locating this little Formosan paradise. My Taiwanese friends who have a lot of international experience often refer to the frustration they feel at having to explain to everyone that they are from TaiWAN, not from ThaiLAND. Yes, they survived the tidal wave nicely, thank you (when I hear such complaints I’m reminded of my Korean friends who express their annoyance at being mistaken for Japanese when they travel, and sometimes revealing a more condescending discrimination when recounting their much greater horror at being mistaken as Chinese. As for myself, I have long since stopped caring if people introduce me as coming from Sweden or Finland, I just feel a bit sorry for Denmark, since it rarely gets offered as my homeland and, really, to be fair, the Danish kingdom did rule over Norway the longest).
Korea’s visibility extends to Taiwan as well. I see buses around Taipei plastered with huge advertisements for the latest Korean historical drama, and a Korean drama always seems to be playing on some channel or other here. Somebody must be watching them. This afternoon I ate Korean food in a food court in a Kaohsiung shopping mall, and Korean 泡菜 (kimchi) or the word 韓式 （Korean-style) is added as a prefix to many food items in many regular Chinese-style restaurants.
Of course, I don’t get the impression the “Korea” brand is anywhere close to the “Japan” brand here in Taiwan in terms of its power. Thousands of Japanese products are sold in stores around Taiwan with their Japanese packaging and labels fully intact. The word “Japan” or “Japanese Style” is printed in big fat or highlighted characters on signs for all manner of products (especially anything related to cosmetics, electronics, and very often for food related items) in a way reminiscent of products sold in the US with “NEW! IMPROVED!” attached. Maybe my memory is off, but I don’t seem to remember anywhere near this extent of explicit use of the Japan brand in Korea.
Of course, everyone knows that Taiwan is infamously pro-Japanese. Japanese men seem to believe they stand a better chance of finding love here in Taiwan than anywhere in Asia. The postwar experience of dictatorship, the 2/28 massacre, and the importance of the long Japanese colonial period to the claims of a distinct Taiwanese national identity all contribute to this. This weekend I was introduced to a somewhat inebriated Taiwanese doctor who was told that I was doing my dissertation on Chinese traitors (漢奸). He turned to me, somewhat perturbed, and proudly announced, almost toppling over as he straightened up, “我就是漢奸！” (I am myself a 漢奸！)
When it comes to Taiwanese sentiments towards Korea, if my very limited exchanges are at all suggestive of anything, the Korean brand power, food culture, and drama fandom seen here are not incompatible with a degree of emotional disdain. Even one of the women included in the comments above who expressed a hatred of Korea and especially Korean women also says that while she loves Japanese kimonos and culture of all kinds she doesn’t like the Japanese people themselves because they, “Are so polite to you all the time but who knows what they are thinking on the inside.” This deep dislike of a purported Japanese “two-facedness” is a familiar image. I remember an elderly neighbor of my parents in Oklahoma who, after decades of negotiations with Japanese chemical companies told me something along the lines of, “Them Japs’d always lie to your face. ‘Yes’ never meant ‘yes,’ and ‘maybe’ always meant ‘no.’ And you’d never know when they might pull a Pearl Harbor on ya.” (His distrust wasn’t limited to the Japanese, however. He spent a lunch once trying to convince me that every evil of the 20th century could be blamed on the inherently demonic nature of the Englishman. I think he bore a very serious grudge against the English ever since he was arrested by an English MP in World War II when he was on shore leave in Gibraltar).
All being said, however, I was a bit surprised to find anything more than, at worst, indifference towards Korea. Instead, I might have expected a feeling of camaraderie for an economically successful and culturally rich counterpart that is similarly struggling to define itself in a challenging geopolitical environment dominated by its larger neighbors.
UPDATE: There was a surprising amount of interest in this posting but I feel my posting didn’t come across quite the way I wanted it to. I am not justifying any of the claims that I quote hear, nor do I think the feelings expressed by my informers were much more than the kinds of stereotypes we all engage in or somehow reflect some kind of genuine bubbling discontent here in Taiwan. On the contrary, of all places I have lived in East Asia, the people I have met here in Taiwan are the most cosmopolitan and open. That was precisely why the rare expressions of dislike for a particular group of people stood out such that it made me notice it and become curious since I expected the contrary to hold true among two places with much in common in their recent history and development.
2010.11 UPDATE: This posting continues to attract attention and I’m sad to see that apparently some Korean sites are linking to it. I just received an email which takes issue with my use of the word hate to translate 討厭:
One point about your interpretation of 討厭 as hate. There is a (quiet big) difference here. Hate is more like 憎恨, 痛恨 which is much much stronger than 討厭 which can be interpreted as “I don’t like.” For example, if you are trying to do your home work and your brother keeps poking/bothering you, you will say 討厭. Or in your word, it’s a more stronger “我不喜歡” (notice the missing 太 here since “我不太喜歡” is a little bit less strong then “我不喜歡”. The former is kind of detour a little while the later more straight-forward.) Probably you don’t really care. But by interpreting 討厭 as “hate” makes all non-Chinese speaking people thinking that man Taiwanese “hate” Koreans which if far from true. My wife and I have checked out many Korean dramas from our local library. We use Korean products all the time (TV, cell phones, camera, monitor, etc.) In fact, I just bought a Samsung camera about 3 weeks ago and this is the second Samsung camera we own. So I’d appreciate that you can spend couple minutes correcting it. Of course, you can ask around and make sure my interpretation is correct.
The writer is correct that 討厭 is not as strong a word as the visceral hatred implied by 憎恨, etc. but I think it ignores that the English word “hate” also has a much wider range – as in “I hate Ice Cream” or “I hate it when he does that.” At any rate, I stand by my basic point, that I have often been surprised to see a pretty emotionally strong (and quick) response from a number of my Taiwanese friends when it comes to Korea and I think it is common enough for us to ponder the reasons for it in the absence of any major historical grievances. Some Koreans are taking this posting as evidence of Taiwanese perfidy to feed their own anger, while some Taiwanese are seeing this is as a blanket condemnation of them. If I did not feel strongly that I should leave my writings, both strong and weak, online, I would take the posting down since it has only led to a negative effect as far as I can see. As the writer indicates, many Taiwanese have a great love for Korean products and culture. I met a number of Taiwanese students studying Korean in various Korean language programs I have attended. It is perhaps partly because of this that there is a strong reaction (though the similar feelings of some of a much older generation need other explanations) against the sudden popularity, as Kerim suggests in his comment. We see similar things in Japan with the rise of the despicable 嫌韓流 related publications that give rise to old racisms. As Sayaka said in the comments: let us all chill out – I raised a flag here, of curiosity as much as of concern, and merely wish for all the peoples of the region to get along well.
Surprised to hear this. Of course it is worth mentioning that Korean culture is even more popular here than Japanese culture these days: most of the soap operas, fashions, and a fair amount of music and movies are coming out of Korea. Perhaps they’ve had an overdose?
I have noticed a light dislike for Koreans with my Taiwanese partners and friends — but they all know I married a Korean woman, so maybe that’s why they tone it down. But I have been under the impression that they didn’t really care, at best.
One of the employees of my biggest client used to date a Korean man, too… Maybe she’s a traitor!
These two countries have so many similarities, they’re like brothers, really, always fighting!
Though some parts of this post are already familiar, it’s good to ‘read’ your thoughts clearly arranged and also to learn new vocabulary.:)
As I said before, I also didn’t know Taiwanese dislike for us but I’m not really bothered with it as it reveals certain types of Korean people, which always excites my curiosity as an external view towards us. When it comes to food, however, I have to defend with the amazingly various range of vegetables we eat.
The last paragraph of the post led me to think that this geopolitical condition could explain why we often define ourselves by comparison, using numerous comparative and superlative forms. I don’t think we need all the time “we have better — than (mostly Japan or China)” and “our — is no. 1 in the world”.
I think there is a distinct difference here between liking the products of the culture and liking the people from that culture.
Also, I think you the idea that Taiwan has “lost” to Korea as an economic tiger is one of the more important sources of the hate. I think it’s an envious hate. A lot of(well, some) Taiwanese who talk about the problems of the economy will say that “we should be more like Korea.” This attitude can be seen when you have news reports suggesting Taiwan should have a “CEO President” just like Korea, because it would be good for business.
Michael Turton talks about this and criticizes it sometimes on his blog.
The Koreans don’t think a CEO prez is good for business. They’ve been protesting ever since he struck the beef deal…
Anyway, I’m not surprised that the Taiwanese reaction to Koreans. I’ve read/heard that a lot of Koreans call the Taiwanese, ‘island chinks’. Anyway, Koreans got strong issues with everybody (‘this one’s dirty, this one’s poor, so it only stands to reason that the people who are the object of their disgust…I don’t know…not like it?)…except China, they’re former oppressors…(before the Japanese, that is.)
Although there are Taiwan-specific reasons for the ill feelings towards Koreans that you’re noticing, there is also a greater pan-Chinese antipathy, fueled by internet content that mostly disparages Koreans for “stealing” Chinese culture. Some of the examples like Goguryeo, are real bilateral conflicts. Others dealing with claims that Koreans once ruled half of China or invented Chinese characters are distortions or exaggerations based on little-read books or historical fantasy dramas. Still others, like the recent viral story about professors at Seoul National University claiming that Mao was Korea, are completely fictitious.
It’s ironic that the Taiwanese would criticize the Koreans as meat-eaters when the traditional plant-based Chinese diet has become dominated by meat and fish. Having lived in both Korea and China, I would say that urban dwellers in both countries eat about the same proportions of animal and plant foods, but the dishes are served differently. Koreans serve a meat or rice/noodle dish as a main entree with vegetable sides while the Chinese serve a variety of dishes that usually contain both animal protein and vegetable but sometimes only one or the other.
An American who lived for decades in Taiwan before moving to the mainland told me that while China was in the throes of the Cultural Revolution, Taiwan was seen as a preserve of traditional Chinese culture, but now that the mainland’s economic rise had fostered a vibrant consumer culture, it is Mainland China that most represents and exports Chinese culture to the world just as South Korea represents and exports Korean culture. Thus, Taiwan has been eclipsed both economically and culturally by both South Korea and Mainland China.
I was surprised as well when a Korean friend here told me some Taiwanese don’t like Koreans- she claimed it was envy that Taiwan has “fallen behind”. On the other hand, my Korean roommate doesn’t seem to notice any resentment.
I personally think it’s mostly personality clash.
Also, I can’t help not responding to the last post about Taiwan “falling behind” culturally. I would say Taiwan is far more vibrant than the mainland. Folk culture is obviously far more popular here; even in Taipei you can see people burning ghost money every month, and Daoist, Confucian and Buddhist festivals remain popular. Even Beijingers who were themselves interested in traditional culture told me that Taipei, not Beijing, was the place to go to study traditional Chinese culture. Traditional culture is more evident in Taiwanese politics, with politicians praying for electoral victory at temples and the government maintaining Confucian-style martyr’s shrines. Taipei is also a center of Mandarin pop culture- Jay Chou, SHE and Ah Mei are all Taiwanese. Taiwanese film may not have received the attention of Chinese film, but Taiwan has produced more than its fair share of excellent directors, like Ang Li, Hou Hsiaohsian, Edward Yang and Tsai Mingliang.
The perception of mainland culture I think has more to do with the political and economic attention the mainland receives.
Interesting observations. Try asking if they prefer Korean or HK… I know my in laws much preferred transferring flights to Beijing via Seoul instead of HK.
In general I often find Taiwanese (and Koreans for that matter live) like to over stereotype even countries next to them. Japan is definitely held up on a pedestal though – particularly in Taichung where a lot of the Japanese owned factories are. Many of the girls there particularly like to date Japanese men.
antipathy towards koreans is not uncommon here in the u.s. its a common sentiment in the u.s. especially in cities with big korean populations in l.a./california and new york. i’ve come across so many people who dont like koreans, even many korean americans dont like koreans from korea which seems strange. but this sentiment it’s really not that unheard of.
regarding taiwan “losing out” to korea economically, what are you talking about? taiwan’s economy has continually been expanding and developing. taiwan grew 6% first quarter of 2008, higher than s. korea’s growth. taiwan hi-tech industry growth like semiconductor and lcd panel has been keeping up with s. korea’s or even surpassing them. taiwan’s ppp of gdp is actually higher than s. korea’s. i think taiwan produces more lcd panels than korea now. and why do u compare asus with lg and samsung? how about acer? every american knows about acer as well as giant bicycle, d-link. companies founded by taiwanese include nvidia, garmin, viewsonic. and just because a country may not have as many globally recognized companies doesnt mean they’re economically inferior to other companies. singapore doesnt have any globally branded companies. did they lose out to korea as well even tho they have a much higher per capita income than koreans?
acer: world’s 3rd largest computer company after hp and dell.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acer_Computer_Australia
i am korean living in new york and this was a interesting article to read. my initial reaction was that it had to be personality clash since taiwanese in general are more quiet. while koreans tend to get loud and outgoing. Also koreans love to drink while the taiwanese i’ve met generally did not dink much. (a group of drunk koreans can be very annoying to anyone)
but even if there was cultural clash. it would be strange for taiwan to hate koreans while looking up to japan.
it may be that the taiwanese feel that they are falling behind in a rivalry which they made with korea. that’s what i think.
A lot of good points. If I could add a couple of cents-worth.
In August 1992 Korea suddenly switched diplomatic recognition from Taiwan to China and handed a very plum embassy over to the ChiComs in Seoul without compensation. Taiwan promptly dropped direct flights between the countries, something not reinstated for several years (too lazy to look up now).
Also, I once was in a park in Hwa-lien (sp?) where somebody whitewashed the Korean half of a Taiwan-Korea friendship plaque. Up to 1992 the two countries had seen themselves as close brothers in the struggle against communist neighbors. Of course this is 16 years later, but I’m sure there’s latent mistrust and bad will over that.
Regarding #10, “it would be strange for taiwan to hate koreans while looking up to japan”:
The opposite would be more strange. There are plenty of reasons for them to look up to Japan, number one being Japan pulled Taiwan up from backwater status, invested in agriculture and industry and introduced universal education and numerous other infrastructure and social improvements. The Taiwanese had a good experience under the Japanese and know they wouldn’t be anywhere near where they are today without it. The Koreans also wouldn’t be anywhere without the Japanese experience, but for various reasons can’t admit it.
Oh god. You should maybe put (half) “satire” on this article, too. People should chill out.
My Taiwanese wife doesn’t like Koreans either (all violent). Or Chinese (all crooks). Or Filipinos (all liars). Or Arabs (all terorists). Or Indians (all cheap and bad smelling). Or Jews (all conspire with each other). Or (insert your nationality here). Except Caucasians and Japanese of course.
I’ve also experienced many similar encounters Munnin.
For sure, there is a response to the Korean cultural threat as some of the sentiments were in regard to it. What I find interesting is that while mainland Chinese might enjoy the same amount of Korean cultural products, they don’t feel threatened by it because their Chinese culture is huge to begin with. That’s understandable of course, but what’s odd is that Taiwanese don’t have that same security, even when they are Chinese themselves and have an entitlement to the history.
mike, you sound like one of the biased Taiwanese yourself… and I’m not even trying to defend the Koreans ’cause I do like the Taiwanese, they tend to be pretty chill and relaxed like Japanese. Lots of cute girls too. To be honest though, in dealing with Western students from NYC and Montreal, most people haven’t heard of Asus (cept the computer crowd) and Acer is seen as seen as a cheap Chinese brand (probably because in stores like Fry’s or Best Buy, they tend to market toward the low price end). Also, people in the West tend to separate the majority of Asians they know into two categories, the top dogs (China/Japan/Korea) and then the Southeast nations (Vietnam/Thailand/Taiwan) and so mistake Taiwan for Thailand quite a bit. This offends Taiwanese quite abit, as to them it’s like saying they are a 3rd world nation (I do explain that Taiwan is very high tech, with top class computer making equipment).
Having taught in S. Korea (as well as Taiwan and Singapore and the West), I’ve never heard the term ‘island chinks’ btw…most Koreans and Korean-Americans actually don’t really know too much about Taiwanese when I’ve brought it up. Actually, I think Korean-Americans hold up the Taiwanese in a better light than other Asians, due to their interest in PC gaming.
Finally, from what I remember, S. Korea was one the last major nations (if not last) to drop support for Taiwan’s UN bid back in ’92, Japan also ditched them a lot earlier, so it’s kind of ironic they would hate the Koreans for that.
Koreans don’t like Taiwanese because Koreans always viewed Taiwanese as ” Half Ass” people. Taiwanese have identity problems. Taiwanese consider themselves Chinese, Japanese, and even ” Taiwanese”. Koreans really don’t like cultural confused people.
Koreans won’t support Taiwan independece. U.N is example.
Yes, I agree. Taiwan always have been Pro-Japan. Japan colonialized Taiwan for 50 years. There are many mixed Taiwanese-Japanese. Koreans are opposite
from Taiwanese.
Japanese view Koreans as competitors in every field.
Whereas Japanese view Taiwanese as ” Brown Noser”.
Of all my experiences with different kinds of ethnicities, Koreans are indeed the worst and it is hard not to hate them. Why are they even in America when they still hold on to their primitive culture of hate and dense beliefs? In school they were always the bullies. When I say always, I mean ALWAYS. Always violent and threatening others when no one ever did anything to them. I have to assume that it is all because of their family and the brainwashing that goes on at home. All the pathetic kids that got kicked out were Korean. I hope they get shipped back to their country (the only place they belong). They only hung out with other Koreans. The first question they’d ask you if you were Asian was “what are you?” and if you say anything not Korean they start trying to mock you. They are sneaky and hate everything that is not Korean but of course they won’t admit anything. Most Koreans I met are arrogant and proud yet there is nothing to be proud of for them. I do believe that they are very talented people (some at least) but their attitudes are the worst. It’s so easy to see through their motives and their hearts. They have a lot of churches down here in CA but all the ones I went to are so pathetic and they don’t want non-Koreans to go there (they actually said that). Truly a bunch of soul-less evil people. If you don’t believe me please find out for yourself (but if you are Asian and not Korean I think you already know what I’m talking about). I know every ethnicity has it’s goods and bads, but the problem with Koreans is their deeply embedded culture which is built on hate. They will do anything to look good but inside they are empty and disgusting people.
Taiwanese and koreans are both aggressive nations, so it is difficult to get along with each other, but i think people just think too much. Both places are full of pride for their advancement in the world. I cant say the korean economy is stronger than taiwan, because taiwanese have been working in isolation and are disadvantaged because of the cross strait tensions, and they are still putting up good numbers, imagine what they could do without restrictions. Koreans however, have spent a lot more money branding their products (hyundai, samsung (huge conglomerate), LG, Hankook (huge market share on tired), KIA), therefore, the world knows there products, plus their companies are huge and very powerful, have direct influence on electronics market. Taiwan is considered the silicon island of the world, creating countless hi-tech products and services, (DLINK, Garmin, Nvidia, Youtube, TrendMicro, Evergreen (4th largest shipping line) the economy is a lot more stable compared to korea. Korea suffered a lot during the 1997 economic crisis, while taiwan rarely suffered. Both have their strengths and weaknesses. It really depends on the person, for one, both taiwanese and koreans are more defensive people, can get easily offended from small things. I know this because I am half korean/half taiwanese, so i know both sides really well =) Both sides should just chill
um, who cares? youre all just asian to everyone else in the world. Asians should unite more. And most Koreans dont even pay that much attention to Taiwan. Maybe Taiwans just angry that all their Japanese ass kissing didnt amount to them being better than Korea.They should just state theyre not Chinese or try to be Japanese wannabe’s and just be Taiwanese.
I came across this article randomly and the content caught my eyes. As I read on to the responses, I started to feel a little uncomfortable. But I want to thank you for your update later on. The sentiment doesn’t speak for all Taiwanese. I know many Taiwanses who are very fond of Korea and its culture, although it may be mostly the influence from Korean TV and pop culture. I myself is a huge fan of Korean food, especially kimchi! A funny thing about it is that I once had a Korean client who told me that he hates the smell of kimchi… so we just have to accept the fact that there are all kind of people in a nation. From my own observation, despite some controversies about history and politics, I admire the Koreans for their respect to traditions and unity. I like how they always stand up to help each other out and defend for their own people when needed. I must also say that most of us, Taiwanese, are very friendly! Don’t let politics and stereotypes get in the way of positive cultural exchanges! That would really be a pity. Peace!
I’m shutting down comments on this posting because I’m tired of dealing with all the comments I’m starting to get with insults and abuse towards Taiwanese and Koreans. It saddens me to see this sort of thing.